From: Dave R---- To: tracy@jesus-is-lord.com <tracy@jesus-is-lord.com> Subject: my testimony and another question!!! Date: Thursday, March 07, 2002 7:11 AM Dear Tracy God Bless you sister hope things are well for you and your family! Before i get to my testimony i would like to ask you something: in 1 corinthians 14:34-35 and 1 timothy 2:11-12 paul is talking about women. now paul says that a woman shouldnt speak in a church, does he mean not to talk at all, not to teach or preach, or was it for some particular circumstances? i havent been able to determine it as yet, i have heard various defences and excuses about those verses, but i am still yet to be satisfied. i dont mind if women talk or teach or preach at church, not at all, but if these passages are saying what i believe they are saying (that women cannot at the least, teach or preach) then is what is being practiced in alot of churches against the will of god, we have a female pastor and guest speakers now and then at my church, so obviously they defend the it was only a special circumstance position, which is fair enough , im only a young babe in christ so they probably understand better than i, but everytime i read those scriptures it seems clear to me that this should not be the case. what are your thoughts tracy? in all honesty it dosent matter to me, but i am only concerned with doing what is right in the sight of the lord - thanks **********MY RESPONSE********* Dear Friend: When you look at the scriptures, it is CLEAR that women are to keep SILENT in the churches. What is happening now is devilish. I see it for myself. I Corinthians 14:34 LET YOUR WOMEN KEEP SILENCE IN THE CHURCHES: for it is NOT PERMITTED UNTO THEM TO SPEAK; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. 14:35 And IF THEY WILL LEARN ANY THING, LET THEM ASK THEIR HUSBANDS AT HOME: FOR IT IS A SHAME FOR WOMEN TO SPEAK IN THE CHURCH. I Timothy tells us *WHY* WOMEN ARE TO KEEP SILENT-- I Timothy 2:11 LET THE WOMAN LEARN IN SILENCE WITH ALL SUBJECTION. 2:12 But I SUFFER NOT A WOMAN TO TEACH, NOR TO USURP AUTHORITY OVER THE MAN, BUT TO BE IN SILENCE. 2:13 FOR Adam was first formed, then Eve. 2:14 And ADAM WAS NOT DECEIVED, BUT THE WOMAN BEING DECEIVED WAS IN THE TRANSGRESSION. Eve was deceived, THAT is why we are to keep our mouths shut. I am a woman [see http://www.jesus-is-lord.com/woman.htm] and I feel that if I preached people would be converted but I cannot honour God by dishonouring His word. Your pastor is in disobedience. Thank you for sending your testimony of how the Lord saved your soul [see www.jesus-is-lord.com/dave.htm]. Though many do not believe it, the Satanic powers are very real. God bless you my friend as you follow on to know the Lord. Write anytime. for Jesus' sake, tracy -- http://www.jesus-is-lord.com ...I do send thee unto them; and thou shalt say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD. And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns be with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they be a rebellious house. Ezekiel 2:4, 6 *********"BUT SIS. TRACY, YOU'RE A WOMAN!"*********** http://www.jesus-is-lord.com/woman.htm *******AN EXCERPT FROM JOEY FAUST******* 2. What if a woman feels as if she is called by God to speak to the assembly? If GOD is leading her, He will be leading her to obey His commands in 1 Corinthians 14 3. But what if your case is different and special? 1 Corinthians 14:36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only? This verse is given in the context of women remaining silent in the churches. NO ONE WILL BE GIVEN ANY SPECIAL REVELATION CONTRARY TO WHAT PAUL HAS BEEN GIVEN! 4. But wasn't this command specifically for the Corinthians? 1 Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in ALL THE CHURCHES of the saints. 34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the LAW. The context is for all the churches of the saints that they may be in godly peace. The LAW is used as an extra witness. Therefore, this is a moral command that is not limited to ages or dispensations. 6. But if women cannot speak in church, how can they lead people to Christ and use their gifts to exhort the saints? First, they may teach women (Titus 2). Women can meet together in the church for women's testimony meetings. They can raise children and instruct them (1 Timothy 2:15, 2 Timothy 1:5). They may teach children in Sunday school classes. Churches can also organize regular, small "prayer fellowships" where women can pray, exhort and testify without addressing the whole church body (Acts 12:12). Women can, and should, witness and lift up their voices on the street in soul winning to those who pass by (Proverbs 1:20-22, 8:1-3, John 4:28). They can exhort believers privately (Luke 24:10, Acts 18:26). They can, and should, use their private homes for "hospitality evangelism" and exhortation (Proverbs 9:1-6, Acts 18:26). And finally, it appears that women may sing holy songs (in modest apparel), even in the mixed assembly (Ephesians 5:19, Colossians 3:16). Paul refers to the "law"(i.e. the Old Testament) in his command for women to be silent in the church (1 Corinthians 14:34). In other words, the submission of women through silence in the mixed assembly is taught by example throughout the whole Old Testament (1 Corinthians 10:11). The only exception in the whole Old Testament is the "prophesying" of Miriam through SINGING (Exodus 15:1, 20). Therefore, the Bible forbids women to address the whole mixed church assembly through preaching, asking questions, leading in prayer, making announcements, giving testimonies, or speaking in "business" meetings, etc. In regard to such regular modes of speaking as these, she is to remain silent. Yet, there is no apparent restriction on singing.